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Post by librarylover on Oct 30, 2009 3:17:03 GMT
Woohoo! I just watched the first part on YT . . . nathan4no3 is a rock star for posting them so quickly!
** I thought it was quite good. I liked that you could hear the TARDIS trying to appear several times, but it sounded strained, like something was blocking it. I'm also happy that the sniping between Mr. Smith and K-9 seems like it is going to be a running gag. "No need to consult the dog!"
The best line goes to K-9 though; "Do not look at me, everything is normal!" **
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Post by johne on Oct 30, 2009 8:18:48 GMT
I'm also happy that the sniping between Mr. Smith and K-9 seems like it is going to be a running gag. "No need to consult the dog!" That's as long as K-9 is going to stick around, and doesn't get blown up or written out. I hope this is just paranoia, but...
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Post by clocketpatch on Oct 30, 2009 21:11:20 GMT
PART TWO:
Part one was fun of just so much awesome win I can barely contain it. You know what I mean: robot!snark, random box alien, stuttering TARDIS, Clyde...
Part two wasn't quite as much fun, but it was still well done, and had it's moments. The Doctor "If you don't know what the TARDIS is, then you REALLY haven't been paying attention" ;D and THEY REFERENCED THE KEY TO TIME! Whoot! And they finally told us what the Trickster is (rather good name for a band, according to Clyde) though, with the Key reference and all, and the changing outfit, I've pretty much decided that he's an embodiment of the Guardians. Yes, obscure canon nerd theoris for the win.
I think this episode played its emotional punch better than the Trickster plot last season, and did a far better job at remaining true to the characters. Sarah-Jane was a victim again, but she wasn't a victim of her own wibbling, and this is progress. And kin of heartbreaking. I was getting all misty eyed at the end there, because that was a really cruel trick.
Also, as predicted, Clyde subtly up-staged the Doctor at pretty much every given opportunity with his "I am so not impressed by you" attitude, and the fact that he went after the Trickster alone with naught but his day-glow hand. Whoot!
Might I reiterate for the billionth time: Clyde is THE MAN
*
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Post by johne on Oct 30, 2009 22:17:02 GMT
[PART TWO] I think Sarah might have been a little hasty to make a beeline for the "If you really loved me, you'd top yourself" approach. Even assuming that everyone would still age as normal in the time bubble, they could have spent a few subjective hours or days trying to come up with an alternative solution. And if the TARDIS could break through the barrier twice, perhaps it could have done so again -- particularly when the Doctor was actually at the controls. But Clyde couldn't wait I'll tell you what I am tired of, though: All this "The Doctor be inevitably doomed! Doomed, I tells you! Aaargh!" foreshadowing. He isn't. We know another series has been commissioned. We've all seen the pictures of Matt Smith, accompanied by Karen Gillan with her long legs and her short skirt. So while it's possible that his friends or his companions or the planet as a whole are going to get it in the shorts, threats against the Doctor himself are, um, a little meaningless.
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Post by Abbyromana on Oct 31, 2009 0:17:07 GMT
I'll tell you what I am tired of, though:
All this "The Doctor be inevitably doomed! Doomed, I tells you! Aaargh!" foreshadowing. He isn't. We know another series has been commissioned. We've all seen the pictures of Matt Smith, accompanied by Karen Gillan with her long legs and her short skirt. So while it's possible that his friends or his companions or the planet as a whole are going to get it in the shorts, threats against the Doctor himself are, um, a little meaningless. I'm pretty sure, johne, they aren't suggesting the Doctor will die, and I doubt anyone really thinks that. The writers and producers are, in fact, hinting at the fact that Ten's run will soon end. The Doctor will soon be regenerating, which the Doctor is not a fan of getting the heads up on that (such as the Watcher giving Four the heads up on his regeneration). That's what the clues have been hinting at since at least Planet of the Dead.
As for the episode, I'm over the moon about this episode. I definitedly give it 5 out 5 stars. I couldn't stop grinning the whole way through both episodes, which I watched consecutively. The build up in episode one was amazing, really giving Elizabeth Sladen a great opportuntity to show a completely different side of Sarah Jane. I really think this is my favorite episode for SJ ever! There was so much SJ love in here to enjoy. The ending in particular stayed in character so very well for me, giving us insight into her thoughts and feelings... things she wished for... a life she could have had, if she hadn't met the Doctor.
I also really love the interaction between the kids, particularly Clyde and Luke interaction. I also love Luke's struggle with it, his little aside but still his way of helping his mum with this new part of her life. Luke and SJ moments are really brilliant this series.
And I agree with you too, CP. Clyde is outstanding. More than once, he did upstage the Doctor, but I think that's fair, considering the Doctor is only the guest star.
As for the ending, I know the old line... "If you love me, you'll do it." is very often used.... but HEY! This is a kiddies show, not the real Doctor Who. It's probably new to them and did fit well with the lines Peter was spouting to Sarah Jane.
Oh, and I completely agree the classic references were really nice additions. It just shows how well travelled the Doctor is and/or how powerful the Tricker is. I agree with CP that the Tricker does appear to be taking on the Guardians roles. I actually ponder if he might be another incarnation of the Guardians. Now, that would be a fun fic idea to run with, exploring the Panthaneon that both the Tricker and the Guardians are apart of.Hmmm.... something to think about writing about one day.
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Post by librarylover on Oct 31, 2009 1:20:02 GMT
Another very well-done episode!
** I know Peter had to go, but it was sad because he was a really nice man, and would probably have fit right in with her alien-fighting lifestyle. I thought the interaction between the Doctor and the kids was great, and the final scene with SJ was well-done. And yes, as usual, Clyde is the man!
Your thoughts on the Trickster being linked with the Guardians was interesting, because it didn't occur to me. Could that be why the Key to Time was mentioned??? **
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Post by Abbyromana on Oct 31, 2009 4:21:18 GMT
Your thoughts on the Trickster being linked with the Guardians was interesting, because it didn't occur to me. Could that be why the Key to Time was mentioned??? ** Could be, and if so, then that might hint at something yet to come.
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Post by johne on Oct 31, 2009 11:32:32 GMT
I'm pretty sure, johne, they aren't suggesting the Doctor will die, and I doubt anyone really thinks that. The writers and producers are, in fact, hinting at the fact that Ten's run will soon end. The Doctor will soon be regenerating, which the Doctor is not a fan of getting the heads up on that (such as the Watcher giving Four the heads up on his regeneration). I suppose so. It's just that this foreshadowing started at Easter, for something that would happen at Christmas. So while it may be 'soon'' for the Doctor, or for a later viewer who watches the DVDs, it isn't particularly 'soon' for me here and now. It feels like a government policy, announced so many times that when it actually comes into effect people find it boring. And telling the Doctor 'you'll soon be going about with a different face' would probably be a better way to put the frighteners on him than dropping vague hints about gates
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Post by Abbyromana on Oct 31, 2009 14:35:50 GMT
I suppose so. It's just that this foreshadowing started at Easter, for something that would happen at Christmas. So while it may be 'soon'' for the Doctor, or for a later viewer who watches the DVDs, it isn't particularly 'soon' for me here and now. It feels like a government policy, announced so many times that when it actually comes into effect people find it boring. And telling the Doctor 'you'll soon be going about with a different face' would probably be a better way to put the frighteners on him than dropping vague hints about gates Oh, good metaphor there, johne! The long wait and very early announcement is like a government policy announcement, even here in the States. True, it might be more accurate to be straight to both the Doctor and the audience... but foreshadowing isn't meant to be straight forward. The vagueness keeps the audience guessing, wondering... and hopefully, on the edge of their seats, and you'll be surprised how much more worried the character becomes when he has only hints or a vague idea of something bad looming ahead.. I know from personal experience myself. So, while it is frustrating, it is also usually a very effective way to keep most of your audience coming back for the next show, particularly when there's so much time between shows, and giving your characters reason to act out of sorts or be suspicious as the story continues
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Post by clocketpatch on Oct 31, 2009 17:34:16 GMT
Two points on the discussion:
1. While we all know it's coming, and that Matty boy will be taking over, this will be the first regeneration for a good sized portion of the audience who won't know quite what to expect. Young children especially, and those non-nerds who haven't been keeping up with every single last spoilers, probably do find the foreshadowing suitably ominous.
Possible WOM/Finale spoilers...
2. I don't think the gate thing is referring to his death. From the spoilers I've read there is going to be something called 'the gate' which will apparently play a large role in the last few episodes. Makes of that what you may...
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Post by timeywimeyding on Nov 1, 2009 14:05:24 GMT
Very good.
*I absolutely love this K9/Mr Smith robot rivalry. More of it, please.
The Brig's back in Peru? Just what is he doing there? Someone?
My only regret is that this episode was such a fan-pleaser, that I can't really look forward to any more SJA. Maybe they should have reserved it for a season finale?
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Post by johne on Nov 1, 2009 14:36:29 GMT
Very good. * The Brig's back in Peru? Just what is he doing there? Someone? Perhaps that's where Cliff and Jo ended up, and they run the Peruvian equivalent of Torchwood? Only more competently, of course.
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Post by jjpor on Nov 1, 2009 22:03:57 GMT
I was going to write some thoughtful criticism on this story, but then thought, who am I kidding? I was grinning like an idiot all the way through both episodes!
*Ten was great in this! It is a fact that the closer it gets to his demise, the more I like him. Strange, that. But yes, brilliant; Tennant was great to watch, loved his interaction with the kids and all the little oldschool continuity references. And yet the way the story was set up made sure he didn't overshadow the SJA regulars, which was good, I thought.
Clyde... Well, just Clyde. He took on the Black Guardian single-handed (pun! pun!) and (sort of) won!
Well, that's my theory, anyway; I think all of that Key to Time malarkey was very suggestive that the Trickster is either some aspect of the Guardian(s) or takes their place in the messed-up post-Time War universe. And didn't he say something about the Doctor falling under "my shadow" or something? Fanw*nk geek that I am, I took this as being a reference to that cackling loon in The Armageddon Factor, but that is completely my own geekery! ;D
As I say in my much more long-winded post about this on lj, all of these Trickster stories basically follow the same plot, don't they? But you did feel for Peter. As johne says, though, was there no way at all that the Doctor - the blinking Doctor, of all people! - couldn't have thought of an alternative way out? Maybe not - it does underline the Trickster's cruelty, I guess, that he set things up that way.
Also have to agree with johne on the prophecies of DOOM! And Tennant's big angsty face as the doors closed, actually. I accept the reasons some of you have suggested for Team Cardiff wanting to do it this way, but I don't know, it's getting a bit old for me by now. As you say, though, for viewers for whom Ten is their first and only Doctor it is probably much more scary and worrying and dramatic, so fair dos.
And I have to agree with Timey - after two such great stories, back to back (I really, really liked last week's one for some reason too), how do they top this? I just want to see what the Mona Lisa one is all about - it looks very strange.*
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Post by Starflower on Nov 1, 2009 22:15:13 GMT
This was a pretty good episode, I thought. ^_^ Season 3 is off to a good start. Though at the end I nearly banged my head on the table in frusteration. Darn Judoon making it so Clyde can't leave Earth. Luke and Sarah could have gone! *insert fanfic*
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Post by jjpor on Nov 1, 2009 22:23:15 GMT
*The Judoon would be no match for Clyde and his awesomeness...no contest! ;D*
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evelyn
UNIT Red Shirt
Posts: 91
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Post by evelyn on Nov 1, 2009 22:31:18 GMT
Yes, Clyde is pure awesome. You'd think that by now they'd trust him when he says something "doesn't feel right"! It probably means his alien sense is tingling!
I liked Ten in this, but was it just me or did he seem a little more manic than usual? Anyways - I love this episode for also providing further Doctor/Sarah material, because they may not really be a romantic ship, but they always seem to be there for the other when it comes down to the fate of...the universe. XD
And starflower, I still think that Luke is gonna end up a companion somewhere along the road. Maybe to Twelve or Thirteen.
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Post by johne on Nov 1, 2009 22:42:37 GMT
As I say in my much more long-winded post about this on lj, all of these Trickster stories basically follow the same plot, don't they? ] That may be why Sarah Jane jumped straight away to the Peter-must-die conclusion. Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. Three times is write the poor chap off as dead meat from the moment old eyeless pointyteeth shows up.[
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Post by Abbyromana on Nov 2, 2009 0:24:46 GMT
This was a pretty good episode, I thought. ^_^ Season 3 is off to a good start. Though at the end I nearly banged my head on the table in frusteration. Darn Judoon making it so Clyde can't leave Earth. Luke and Sarah could have gone! *insert fanfic*
*points at computer database of WIP fanfic* Oh, I am, starflower. For me at least, I am writing such fics.. some of them where Luke is a companion on the TARDIS.
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Post by jjpor on Nov 3, 2009 21:48:28 GMT
*Yes, as johne points out, they did seem to leap straight to the most emotionally resonant solution, and I'm sure the Doctor, given time, could have thought of _something_, but it's amazing how often he doesn't in those sort of situations... ;D*
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Post by Abbyromana on Nov 3, 2009 23:35:40 GMT
* Yes, as johne points out, they did seem to leap straight to the most emotionally resonant solution, and I'm sure the Doctor, given time, could have thought of _something_, but it's amazing how often he doesn't in those sort of situations... ;D* True, but the Doctor doesn't always take the lead. In fact, I recall quite often in new and old Who, he prefers to lead others to take actions, motivate them to right the wrongs that directly impact them.
Also, this isn't his show. His name isn't in the title, but Sarah Jane's name is, so in the end, she has to take action, not him.
Additionally, he couldn't act, since he was trapped in the TARDIS, outside the temporal trap, and I think he knew that. Sarah Jane was in a far better position to act and influence the factors that would save them all.
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